The Place For My Writers Notes

Original Posting 1 Feb 2012

I've been thinking about that question you raised, Gene, about just how good, final -- perfect? -- Something needs to be before submitting it.

It's a problem that comes up in many areas. In the classes that I teach, I often run into students who think I'm only interested in "the right answer." Since many of the questions I ask have many right answers, or sometimes none, they often struggle. It's hard for them to realize that only in taking a look at some possible answers, and why we might choose them, are we likely to find our answer today.

Anyway, in this case, let's look at a couple of situations. One is just the ordinary process of writing. You get an idea, you put some words around it, you revise that -- this is mostly individual work. At some point, though, you probably want some feedback to find out how it works, what people notice about it, and what they don't notice. Next, you probably want to revise it a bit, and eventually, maybe you push it out to one or more of the publishing channels (self-publishing, traditional publishing, something else?)

In this case, you probably submit it here on WRITERS in an earlier version. It could be very early -- at the idea or rough draft stage, or maybe just the scene -- if you're looking for some early advice or help. Of course, none of us is going to write it for you, but maybe you want to ask if we've seen anything like this idea you had about making Abe Lincoln be a secret vampire hunter or something? (Oddly, I have recently heard about this little genre that apparently is growing, taking various historic entities, mixing historic fact and a healthy dose of fiction to create... George Washington, vampire slayer? Stuff like that.)

Okay. However, it's more likely, you've worked on it to a point where you feel pretty good about it -- it's ready for a workshop review, comments and critique -- so you submit it here so that we can do that. You're looking for feedback, a critique, to help put the final polish on it.

Or maybe you have polished it as far as you can, and you just want someone to take another look at it? That's another good point to submit it here.

So I guess there's three different stages where asking for feedback from the group seems to make sense. Early in the process, just to kick the idea around, or to ask for suggestions about how to avoid that "looking in the mirror" scene, or to ask whether something you're trying works. Later in the process, to get that helpful second opinion, to see what it looks like in someone else's eyes. Towards the end of the process, to get a double check.

The other situation that I wanted to look at was something like 6 x 6, where we're trying to push out a story each week. The point of the exercise really is that it helps loosen up that drive for perfection that most of us fall into from time to time. Because come -- Saturday, right? -- We need to send that story out, whether it's gotten that very last polish or not. And then turn around and start the next one. So we don't have a lot of time to think it over, one more time, maybe change a little bit here, what about... Just shove it out.

One of the real benefits that I see is that often we are our own harshest critics. That story that we're shaking our head over may get a hearty greeting if you just send it out! At the very least, you'll find out which parts people really notice.

Now I do think, especially if we're sending something to the traditional publishers, but even for self-publishing, it's worthwhile to get it in good shape. But even there, we need to be careful to avoid perfection paralysis, where we never send anything out because we're polishing it just one more time. Here again, the 6 x 6 exercise seems like a useful way to combat that tendency, because we're likely to learn that it doesn't really need to be perfect.

Anyway, how good does it need to be to submit it here on the list? Well, I really think that's up to you. Especially for 6 x 6, I wouldn't fret too much. We all know the time is short, and here comes Saturday again! 6 x 6 should be fun, not deadly.

I guess the other thing I keep trying to explain is my notion that we learn from mistakes. The WRITERS list needs to be a safe place to make mistakes. That's what a writing group is really all about, is being able to share our mistakes and learn from them. Of course, this means that posting something with some errors in it is almost better than posting it too smooth. Not that we need to introduce errors, particularly, but that trying to get every single one out is just too hard. In fact, what one person sees as an error may not seem to be an error to others, and we can learn from that, too.

Another benefit that I see to 6 x 6 is that we're likely to maybe try out some smaller ideas, just because we know we've got to get a story out this week. So instead of the blockbuster wonderful idea, maybe we just write something a little bit simpler. I know I get wrapped up in trying to make a great story, and I just need to relax and tell some small stories. Because we are pushing out ideas quickly, it's a little bit easier to try some of the other ideas. And sometimes those turn out pretty well.

Anyway, the short version is, especially for 6 x 6, post it! Submit it even if it's not finished, even if everything hasn't been completely polished, and then go on to the next idea. I think part of the exercise is the pacing, developing an idea fairly quickly, putting it together, then sending it out and letting go of it. Because it's time for the next weekly story.

I hope some of this makes it easier. Sorry this is so long, I'm not sure I have time to tighten it up -- I've got to write a story!

aka Write Notes to Yourself

This is especially appropriate for projects that you have to pick up and put down over time, but I think it also might be useful for nanowrimo writers. The notion is very simple -- especially when you're sitting down or stopping your work, even if you think you'll be back soon and you're sure that you'll remember, write yourself some notes. What are you thinking about? What do you want to come back to later? What questions are percolating around in the little grey cells? What do you think you're going to do next right now? Just a line or two to remind you when you come back.

Even those of us who don't have the excuse of growing gray hairs often find that sometimes when coming back to pick up work in progress, you can't quite remember where you were and what you were going to do next. A couple of lines of notes can help resurrect that memory and make the pickup smoother. And when I'll get back to it soon turns into a somewhat more protracted delay than had been expected, those hints and reminders can be lifesavers.

I've been reading the online weekly serial novel Saltation at http://www.korval.com/saltation/ -- the authors are writing this in first draft on the web. And along the way, we've seen a few notes from the authors to themselves, reminders about things that need to be reworked, and such. So here we have an example of working writers who keep these kind of in-progress notes to help themselves stay on track.

I suppose if you want to you can use the Microsoft Word commenting features. I used to simply write these into the document, often with a standard such as Note: and then I could use find to locate them when I was doing revision or editing. As I took care of them, I would remove them, so that the final document wouldn't have any left in it. But while in progress, such embedded reminders to myself were gold. And of course, programs have comments so that you can include them -- and I used to enforce commenting standards on my programming groups.

When you're thinking about organizing and writing a novel -- 50,000 words, hundreds of pages? -- you need to plan on stepping away from the work and coming back. One way to help yourself do that is to make notes about where you're going as you stop. Then when you come back, reading the notes can help you get back into the swing quickly. You may also want to make notes as you're going as you realize various things. Maybe your hero just shot the villain with a crossbow, and you want to remind yourself to go back in revision and have the hero practicing with a crossbow ahead of time. Especially in nanowrimo, you shouldn't stop now and do that revision -- so write yourself a note to remind yourself to do it later. Or maybe you've just written a cute little scene with the hero and sidekick getting the sidekick's hair caught in the car window and having to untangle it. You might want to make a note that the sidekick has long hair, just to make it easier to remember what the sidekick looks like later without having to scramble around rereading your writing.

Admittedly, you don't want to spend all your time making notes to yourself. Still, I think at break times and when you have those "I want to remember this later" or "remind me to do this later" thoughts, writing your thoughts down is good practice. I certainly have found that the great idea I had yesterday that I wanted to remember to do today sometimes isn't quite as easy to remember today as I thought it would be. And it can be really frustrating to know that you had that insight yesterday -- what the heck was it?

Write it down. Scratch paper or notepads are really cheap. And they work fine, even without electronics.
tink
(about 675 words)
Scribble while you work - and when you stop, too!

[In regards to the subject line -- do you remember when passing notes in class was considered cheating? And as for writing little notes to yourself while studying and then reading them during the test -- well, most teachers frowned on that? When you're doing nanowrimo, it isn't cheating anymore :-]

Original posting: Wed, 2 Mar 1994 11:45:26 JST

FAQ: Assorted Rules! (was: Re: Practice Safe Postings)

[with apologies in advance to those I have quoted without permission, paraphrased wildly, or otherwise cribbaged. I been a bad boy...]

and with thanks to Erik for suggesting it.

assorted rules for the ruleless, by the ruler's edge, and off the listless: (Rule De Writers, De Writers rule de list...)

0. Consider your readers. Do unto them at least as well as you would like to be done to, and consider giving better than you get.

1. 50/50 rule - try to post at least one writing-related, semi-serious post for each chatter, joke, short, meaningless, post. Balance your postings! (attributable to jc, if you're keeping score)

2. Rubber Band Limit - congratulate yourself when you only post one or two in a day. Feel the rubber band pinch as you post more. Feel it snap and hit your nose when you get into double-digits.

3. Positive charge - if you can't say something positive, don't say anything. Try to make sure each posting has at least one positive contribution - for everyone on the list.

4. Don't get personal, asshole. Nobody likes to be called stupid, idiot. And similar redundancies...

5. Think about your presentation. The best points in the world, the most wonderful intentions, are worthless if you make the reader so angry they never even notice what you were saying in between the insults, implied putdowns, and other verbal abuse.

6. Start by assuming that the other person was making a reasonable statement from their understanding. Figure out what understanding would make what they said reasonable. Then try to figure out how to say what you want to so that someone with that understanding will see what you are pointing to. It isn't as easy as saying they are idiots and lighting up the flamethrowers to crisp them, but it can be more satisfying.

7. You don't have to respond to everything. If someone seems to be upset, give them a break. That means resting, not hitting them again and again.

8. Avoid trying to "beat" the other person, "win" the argument, or otherwise end the discussion. In most cases, differences of opinion are not solved by debating, no matter how heated - but anger, frustration, and other emotional irritants are racked up to dump later.

9. Read the FAQ on Sparks and Irritations

10. MAD - Mutual Assured Destruction. It's the exact same thing whether the weapons are the wild words of verbal abuse or the final solution of strategic nuclear armaments.

Randy's short takes:

First (a face to face method), let the other person have his/her say before you explain why he/she is wrong, always has been, always will be.

Second (a generally applicable tactic), if you have something to say that a group of, oh, say about 200, 300 might like to hear, say it. If not, don't say it.

Third (specific to WRITERS), try to keep your postings to subjects at least peripherally about writing.

Fourth (applicable to all listservs), remember that some members have to pay more than others to be connected and try to economize as a courtesy to them--gather your thoughts for a few posts; think about what you want to say; say it as well as you can. If nothing else, it promotes conciseness and may even make the REVISION monster less dreadful to contemplate.

From Bill Siers:

Play nice or I'll yank you out of the sandbox and separate you! KIDS!

From Eliz:

Try common sense and respect for the other person. A little bit goes a long way.

From MJI (MOMMIE!):

Do a beagle dance, wail at the moon, and it'll be all right now!

From Bruce:

try to make the message content more than a header and signature. everyone likes some meat in their sandwiches.

From Erik:

Behind even the shortest message or most confused writing, there is a person. They may be calling for help, or just having a bad day.

From Drex:

When you walk in the door, being called names and hearing insults passed around like toys isn't real nice. Give the new kids on the block a chance to find out what kind of gang you are before you string them up.

From Mary Poppins:

Just a spoonful of sugar makes the medicine go down...

And from tink:

If you can't come up with something concise, make 'em laugh. Happy people want to be more happy, so they keep reading. Angry, bored, and otherwise upsot folks just want to wipe, flush, and go - and that's when the **** hits the bucket, if you'll pardon me putting my asterisks out in public.

<push the little lever on the back there, and let's all watch the swirling to see which way it goes... down, huh?>

original posting: Wed, 28 Feb 2001 21:24:00 -0500

From Writing As a Lifelong Skill by Sanford Kaye


...

Example

Feedback: What We Want
    - honest comments
    - what errors have I made?
    - how can I improve this piece of writing?
    - what strong points do you see in my writing?
    - what caught your attention?
    - what did you like?
    - did you get my point?
    - where did you lose interest?

Feedback: What We Don't Need
    - comments in red ink
    - "Not a good writer." [tink -- or that famous one, "No Good Writer would..."]
    - "Good paper"-- and nothing else
    - "This paper stinks" -- and no explanation.
    - "Vague" -- and no examples.
    - "who cares?"
    - "You're wrong to think that..."

taken from page 58

It is an interesting exercise.  What do we want when we ask for feedback?  What do we not want?

You might also want to consider how you can promote the kind of feedback you want, and what you are going to do when you get the kind of feedback you don't want (I don't know if there is a good way to avoid getting the wrong kind of feedback, but how you respond may decide whether you get more, how you feel about getting it, and so forth).

Suppose you could ask your readers for just the right scratch to calm your itch.  What would you ask for?  And where would you warn them away from?

(ah, that soothing balm of well-applied scratching!  Relief is just... a friendly set of fingernails away?)

write?